Pedophiles and Homosexuality
Posted by Adam Graham in : PoliticsGiven some of the comments in a recent post, I’ve decided to cross post this from WhereIStand:
Our dear liberal friend, Mister E has stopped merely responding to what I say but trying to predict what I must be thinking:
I can only imagine that in his uneducated mind he’s making the connection to Foley being gay and child molestation.
Well, my mind is fine, thanks. Of course, Mister E does provide me an education in explaining that pedophilia and homosexuality have no link as he cites that greatest possible source, "a random blogger" More accurate it’s a random commenter on a random blog without any citation.
Family Research Council has research which demostrates a likely correlation:
Pedophiles are invariably males: Almost all sex crimes against children are committed by men.
· Significant numbers of victims are males: Up to one-third of all sex crimes against children are committed against boys (as opposed to girls).
From this and the fact that Homosexuals make up around 3% of the population we can conclude 3% of the Population is accounting for 33% of the Pedophilia.
Does this mean every homosexual is a pedophile? Certaintly not. What it suggests is there’s a higher incidence of it than in the straight community.
I certainly needn’t refer to NAMBLA to find an example of support for pedophilia. In Great Britain, thanks to the efforts of homosexual activists and the Labour Party, what Mr. Foley did would be perfectly legal as the age of consent was lowered to 16.
Mr. E’s little known commenters allege there’s no such thing as straight or gay pedophilia and that’s really utter nonsense. If a male pedophile goes after girls, he’s a hetrosexual pedophile. If he goes after boys, he’s a homosexual pedophile. If he goes after both, he’s a bi-sexual pedophile. The basis for Mister E’s claim is fallacious and what else is new and their exists a greater propensity towards pedophilia among homosexuals than there is among hetrosexuals.
No one is saying all homosexuals are pedophiles, but facts though inconvenient do speak for themselves.
A comemnter responded:
adam, You’re actually, surprisingly enough, making a modicum of sense of here, but your argument sort of doubles back on itself at the end.
First of all, where did you get the 3% number? Gays make up 10% of the population, not 3%. Perhaps you were thinking of priests. 3% of priests may be gay, but general pop is more like 10%.
Secondly, you say “almost” all sex crimes are committed by males. How much is “almost”? Everytime I turn on the television another female teacher is giving private lessons to some male student.
I don’t think your numbers (while convenient) really add up, but your concession that all homosexual are not pedophiles certainly is a break in the clouds from your usual transparent agenda.
don’t think your numbers (while convenient) really add up, but your concession that all homosexual are not pedophiles certainly is a break in the clouds
Good question, the best information I found is here regarding female pedophiles and it estmates the number to be at 10%. Dr. Ron Holmes notes:
Male pedophiles molest boys almost as often as girls, but that’s not so with female sexual predators."If you have a female pedophile," Holmes said, "her victims are almost always girls. That’s just the way it is/"
Almost always is a hard figure to use, so let’s say 80-20%. We’re estimating here because we’re dealing with a dark figure.
So, remember that 70% of Sexual assault victims are girls, 30% are boys, so let’s take away 2% of boys and 8% of girls. That leaves us:
62% girls
28% boys
So that 28% of Boys is being molested by Homosexuals or Bi-Sexuals.
Now, the 10% myth came from Kinsey and was abandonned and Homosexual groups have embraced a study from the 1990s showing 2.8%, 1.4% of women identified themselves as homosexual, lesbian, or bisexual.
2.0% of men identify themselves as homosexual and 0.9% of women as Lesbian. Homosexual men make up 0.70% of the Population and Lesbians make up 0.32% of the population. Following their math, BiSexual men make up 0.28% of the Population, and Bisexual women make up 0.17% of the Population. There’s some imperfection in the math due to rounding we end up with 1.47. So, let’s go ahead and simplify it for the purpose of this excercise and round the total of Gay/BiSexual Men as a percentage of US population up to 1% and Lesbian/BiSexual Women up to 0.5%
Now having done that we have to do some clarifications because the percentage of US Population is misleading, as those who are under 18 in most cases really can’t be pedophiles, so let’s go ahead and take out of consideration the 25% of Americans under age 18.. Doing this will augment the number of homosexuals by a third. So thus of the Adult population, 1.33% of Americans are Gay/Bi-Sexual men and .67% are Lesbian/Bi-Sexual women.
So let’s get back to our numbers. Homosexuals/Bi-Sexual men as 1.33% of Adults nationwide account for 28% of the Pedophilia.
Let’s break this down even further, assuming men make up 48.5% of the population and women make up 51.5%:
Straight men=47.17% of the adult population-62% of the Pedophiles
Homosexuals/Bi-Sexual Men=1.33% of adult population, 28% of the Pedophiles
Straight Women=50.83% of the adult population=2% of the Pedophiles
Lesbians/Bi-Sexuals=0.67% of the Population, 8% of the Pedophiles.
So if you created a statistic for this where you took a population’s percentage of pedophiles and divided it by the percentage of the population, you’d arrive at a Pedophile ratio and here’s what we come up with:
Straight Men=1.31
Homosexual/Bi-Sexual=21.05
Straight Women=0.04
Lesbian/Bi-Sexual=11.94
Of course these numbers could be fine tuned up or down a little and the great challenge we have to remember when dealing with the issue of sexual assault is much of this lies in the dark figure of crime. Still, I think from statistics out there, there’s enough evidence that homosexuals do have a greater propensity towards this for whatever than Hetrosexuals as a proportion of the population.
Again, this does not tell us that all homosexuals/Lesbians are pedophiles.
Regarding the stories of female pedophilia in the news, I’ll agree those have been in the news, but do you know why something makes the news? Rarity. There are hundreds of cases of pedophiles who do not make it out of the local news network. A female pedophile makes nation news because it’s a rare occurance. How rare? Go to the national sex offender registry and find the number of males v. the number of female offenders in your area. In a mile radius of my house there were about 20 total and only one was a woman.
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Comment by binkyboy [Visitor]
See, here is where you get things wrong. You are counting on the FRC to provide you with true statistics, when in fact, they are non-peer reviewed skewed pseudo-research, usually done looking for a specific ends, so they are willing to overlook the means.
I understand your need to dehumanize homosexuals, and to demonize them, but you only make yourself look like a tool when you continue to use false statistics and misleading studies to make your case.
Just like that lying scumbag, Bryan Fischer.
Comment by binkyboy [Visitor]
Adam, where do you get the 28%? I notice that figure just pops in there, never having existed in your little “experiment”.
Also, you can only come up with these numbers if you redefine pedophilia, and your assumption that those 18 and younger can’t be pedophiles? I’d like to see a reason you decided to make that assumption. I think the APA would definately disagree with you.
See, you don’t understand what you are doing here. You are at the bidding of the church, demonizing a segment of the population for nothing other than legislature. You arn’t going to remove the ghey from society, you arn’t going to cure them, you arn’t going to change these numbers. You are using fake statistics and your pathetic assumptions to harm a segment of society. That makes you a bigot, although a statistical bigot.
Shoot, 47% of the population knows that 90% of the statistics are made up on the spot.
Comment by Adam Graham [Member]
Um, because to be a pedophile is to have sex with a minor. A minor is under 18. Now, true there may be little quirks of state laws, where a 16 year old has sex with a 14 year old, but come on, let’s not play games.
Yes, I may never remove the “ghey” (whoever they are) from society but you will never succeed in removing the “e” from aren’t no matter how much you try.
Comment by binkyboy [Visitor]
No, Adam, sex with someone under the age of 18 doesn’t automatically make one a pedophile, and your inability to understand that goes to the heart of this argument.
You ignore organizations the protect and counsel children, you ignore organizations that have worldwide recognition and you ignore the major schools of thought and you make these claims? For what ends? What do you want to do, force gay’s underground? Make them hide, make them shunned and reviled by society?
I read your dissertation to that question a few months ago, it’s nothing more than God gibberish and biggotry with very little of your thoughts having the consistancy of independence from the AFA, the FRC, or even the CCC.
And stop playing pathetic semantics games and answer a question for once.
Comment by Adam Graham [Member]
I ignore them because they’ve been subjegated by a homosexual agenda. They’re making political, not medical judgments. And no, I have no intention of making homosexuals hide underground. That’s not my plan, sir. And if you read that, you’d know it.
Comment by binkyboy [Visitor]
Thats what you plan will accomplish, yet you seem ignorant, perhaps willfully of that fact.
And no, there is no homosexual agenda, but I’m glad you’ve tried out the Conspiracy Theory game. I’m sure our hosts have some great parting gifts for you.
You’ve proven it’s pointless, your mind is closed. You are going to hate, revile and demonize homosexuals without regards to facts, with disregard for their humanity and in the fact of the teachings of Christ. How can anyone that reads this blog begin to trust you or anyone that you’re affiliated with, such as Bryan Fischer? I don’t think you know you’re lying, that you are furthering the cause of those that wish to turn America into a fundamentalist Christian nation. If you want an “agenda” maybe you should check out what Daddy Dobson and his clones are doing with a little more pessimism. I don’t think you’re capable of it, though, you’re just too wound up in the whole thing to see anything with an open mind, and pessimism does require that, at the very least.
Comment by Adam Graham [Member]
Sorry, but no, I’m aware of the Agenda of Focus on the Family and if we succeed the result we’ll be a far better society for everyone, including you.
Comment by binkyboy [Visitor]
No Adam, I won’t be better off. I will be corralled, I will be shunted. Because I don’t believe in God or Allah. I don’t automatically assume that those that claim to know God’s will are telling the truth. I will challenge those that promote hate, that promote intolerance in the name of religion. Wars, genocide and worse have been done because of agendas like the AFA and I’ll have no part of it.
Your agenda will mean death, great amounts of it. Intolerance, death camps, anarchy are the only results that come from religious domination and the demands that it forces on a society. Nothing good has come from agendas like that.
Long live the FSM. Arrgh, I’m a pirate.
Comment by Adam Graham [Member]
Sad, paranoia. One wonders why you live in Idaho if you think so poorly of your neighbors.
Comment by Cameron [Member]
BinkyBoy,
I’d be curious to know if you have any statistics to compare with those that Adam has provided?
Comment by binkyboy [Visitor]
Yes Cameron, I have plenty of statistics. I have posted a couple of them on 43rd State Blues, and I can find more if you would like.
Essentially, though, I will summarize the findings of many doctorate level studies: that the percentage of sexual child abuse by homosexuals is exactly the same as their percentage in society, slightly above 2%.
I would even be willing to accept a slightly higher figure, if the study concluded that there was a reasonable standard deviation and that the number studied was high enough. I would also respect a study that didn’t attempt to redefine homosexuality in order to raise the percentage.
Those that keep twisting the definition of homosexuality would normally end up with over 10% of the population as homosexual (and possibly as high as 40-50%, I would estimate). The problem is that they won’t post their redefinitions in a succinct manner that can be repeated by other studies.
Comment by Adam Graham [Member]
My method is that if a Pedophile has sex with a male he’s either Homosexual or BiSexual. I think that’s pretty plain.
Comment by binkyboy [Visitor]
And yet most Pedophiles that have sex with the same sex would not agree with that, they would identify themselves as heterosexual, almost violently. Many are married and/or have normal relations with those of the opposite sex and identify with heterosexuals.
And unfortunately for you, the scientific and medical world agrees with me on an overwhelming basis.
Comment by Adam Graham [Member]
They may claim or self-identify as hetrosexual but their actions identify them as bi-sexual.
It’s as if I declared I was a non-smoker and swore up and down that I was, but went out and smoked that the same researchers would no doubt declare me a non-smoker because of my declaation.
Comment by binkyboy [Visitor]
This is going nowhere. You’re just a simpleton, Adam, you don’t want to agree with anything that doesn’t agree with your simple worldview.
Homosexuals are just as unlikely to be a predator as you or ayone else. You can accept that or you can be a whackjob screaming at your bunny slippers in a home somewhere. Hatred has that effect.
Comment by Adam Graham [Member]
Wow, and now we know that being against Homosexual Rights causes Alzheimers.
Comment by Cameron [Member]
BinkyBoy,
I went to your site and read the study you linked to. In the meantime, you and Adam have brought up the very thing that your study fails to address. That is, is a man that molests a boy a homosexual? This is what your study says on the matter:
“It might be argued that women offending against girls and men offending against boys constitutes homosexual conduct. One might also argue that the men in heterosexual relationships with the mothers or grandmothers of abused boys were really “bisexual” because of the evidence of relationships with individuals of both sexes. However, this post facto characterization of behavior, in addition to distracting us from the reality that child abuse has occurred, takes us far afield from the question of whether or not a group of persons may be committing a disproportionate amount of the child abuse in the community.”
Huh? That’s a big time avoidance of the question.
Adam’s statistics are based on the assumption that man/boy contact “proves” homosexuality. This particular study does not disprove that assumption.
Also of note is this paragraph,
“The central problem in conducting this study was attempting to establish the alleged offender’s sexual orientation. The authors had to decide on a definition of what might identify someone as homosexual. Definitions of homosexual orientation can be based on (1)categorization of specific sexual behaviors, (2)self identification, or (3)social perception of the individual’s presentation to the community.”
(bolded numbers added)
The study uses only one of the above forms of defining homosexual orientation: social perception. I would argue that social perception of homosexuality was very different when this study was conducted (1994) than it is now. To be sure, more homosexuals were “in the closet” then than now. Perceiving if these men were homosexuals would be much more difficult because it was much more hidden.
I do have more general critiques of the study. Only 269 children were studied. Of these, only 50 were boys. That doesn’t seem very representative of the abused population. Interestingly, 84% of the abused boys were abused by men. However, 94% of the abused girls were abused by men as well. Also of note is the fact that all of the abusers are categorized as “alleged”. None of the data used for the study comes from the abusers or from court records. Therefore, we don’t know if any of the “alleged abusers” is actually the abuser. They have simply been accused.
The study itself proposes ways to improve,
“The current study would be improved if done prospectively with a standardized interview format where negative responses were routinely charted.”
“The definitive study of this question would be a prospective, longitudinal design that collected data concerning a specific cohort of children over a time frame of many years.”
I appreciate the link to a peer reviewed study on the subject. However, this one doesn’t answer the question at hand.
I will post this at your site as well.
Comment by binkyboy [Visitor]
Cameron,
the number of studies done by groups like the AFA and other hyper religious groups far outnumber the number of studies done and published by the “gay agenda” drivers. Right now, the article I linked to is the definative article used by most social scientists and trackers of social abnormalities, such as pedophilia.
I’m trying not to make the “everyone knows” claims that Adam makes, but essentially the APA and other organizations that study and define the definitions of scientific labels agree with the first study, and they note the smallish sample size. I have the same disagreements with you on some of the methods used and I keep looking for more peer reviewed studies that give a more definative answer to this question.
My disagreement with radical religious groups is that they want to dehumanize and demonize gays with studies that just don’t meet the requirements and redefine relationships to make things appear much worse.
Homosexuals deserve the same recognitions in communities as everyone else. If we really want to skew numbers and react poorly to a situation, lets look at the number of priests and religious personel that have abused male children. Are all of those homosexual? Are they previously abused? Who are they? Why should any priest be allowed near a child?
And yet, despite what should have been a great fear of these “gay” priests, no priest has been killed because of their sexuality or their abuse of a child, no one has hysterically over-reacted to the priesthood’s abuse of children and forced laws on them to separate them out of normal society.
Yet thats not the same for homosexuals that want to live a normal life with a single partner, that are healthy, that deserve to live in health and happiness. People like Adam and Bryan Fischer want to shove these people back into the alleys and closets of society, so that they are forced to hide their sexuality behind false fronts. It gives these people more comfort when they arn’t confronted by homosexuality in any form whatsoever.
Comment by Cameron [Member]
BinkyBoy,
I appreciate your reply. What I find frustrating is that a study such as this one, with all its many faults, is touted as evidence in discussions like the one Adam has here. It is not evidence. Yet it is cited by many other studies and editorials and activists.
The study was completed in 1994, and it actually described the type of study that would be much more definitive. Has no one done that study? Why not?
Is there no one that has addressed the underlying question in your discussion with Adam? That is, does a man/boy relation make that man a homosexual?
Comment by binkyboy [Visitor]
The discussion would be from the APA, which has held that pedophilic tendancies are not consistant with homosexuality. Many studies of erotic response has shown that male child abusers are not aroused by homosexual erotica/images, but instead by female images. A lot more on this topic can be found here: (embedded links don’t work, sorry)
http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/Articles/000,002.htm
There are so many studies and links within that article, that I find it difficult to cherry pick any for this discussion.